P.G. Moreno Can’t Get Enough “Adventurous Music” and Austin’s More Interesting For It

P.G. Moreno (Courtesy of P.G. Moreno)

Having weathered the ubiquitous pandemic hiatus, local improvised music advocates Epistrophy Arts came back strong with two presentations this year: jazz legends Andrew Cyrille and Billy Harper at the Scottish Rite Theater in May and Colombia’s eclectic Meridian Brothers at Antone's this month.

Make that three. On Wednesday, Epistrophy welcomes dynamic Norwegian/Swedish jazz combo Atomic, the lineup of which includes erstwhile Austinite Ingebrigt Håker Flaten, to the Draylen Mason Music Studio (41 Navasota St.) On the occasion of the 24-year-old institution’s successful return after two years of inactivity, we spoke to founder, curator, and host P.G. Moreno about where EA is going, where it came from, and the challenges of keeping a nonprofit arts organization in motion.

Austin Chronicle: Were you nervous about how the Cyrille/Harper show would turn out? [Note: the duo played to a packed house.]

P.G. Moreno: I’m buoyed by the fact that in this town, you don’t have to tell people who Andrew Cyrille or Billy Harper are – they just know. For that reason I feel a certain confidence. But then there’s all these other factors you have no control over. There could’ve been a big jazz and blues thing happening at some other venue that night. So every show is just go for broke, a leap of faith, believe. Until the show happens, I’m not relaxed. [laughs]

One thing I noticed is a lot of new people. We talk a lot about how Austin’s changing, the cost of living, and a lot of negative things. But cool people are also moving to town, and there’s a lot more diversity. So the problem for us is figuring out how to find those people. But Epistrophy Arts plus jazz legends: it’s guaranteed. But it’s hard to make those things happen – to find the opportunities, the schedule, the time. It can be two years or more to make it happen.

AC: What are the challenges to keep the financial wheels greased?

PGM: There’s a new landscape that I’m feeling my way around. The funding program from the City of Austin is being overhauled, so there’s a lot we don’t know about how Epistrophy Arts will be funded at the same level. I’ve had other sources, but not regularly. We got some great funding from Chamber Music of America to present Wadada Leo Smith’s Ten Freedom Summers, and we’ve had smaller awards from foreign consulates and cultural organizations around the world. The challenge is to look for bigger grants, but also look at the philanthropic community here, and see how we can align with foundations, private equity or whatever. There’s a lot to learn there.

AC: Then there’s the challenge of getting acts from overseas to come over.

PGM: The jazz touring network in Europe came roaring back. In the US it’s a little slower, and bringing Europeans to the US is hard. I hope we can take a lead role in reforming immigration policies for the arts and musicians. It’s untenable for independents. U2 can come here and play and have no problems getting visas, but the times we’ve had to get visas for musicians, it’s been arbitrary, frustrating, and difficult. They don’t really make enough money to justify some of the expenses.

But the goal is to build new audiences, promote international cultural exchange, work with scenes and communities that are grass roots like we are, try to unite those scenes as much as possible, and advocate for more equitable and fair immigration law requirements. There’s plenty of work to do in that department.

AC: Epistrophy Arts recently became an official nonprofit.

PGM: The nonprofit status opens up a lot of new possibilities, and a lot of new responsibilities. There’s a lot of activity here in Austin. The way the city funding is set up there’s five or ten other organizations that bring the kind of music we do. So I want to figure out how to position Epistrophy Arts in a way that we could break up some of the work, do heavy hitters, legends, and some different things, and just move forward and try to really raise the profile.

One aspect that’s been missing is the artist workshops and master classes. We’ve done some, and we’ve been doing the school gigs. That’s gotta be central, because that really gives me the energy and the positivity for the future of the music when I see kids reacting honestly to it. But we need to step up and bring these artists and involve them in the community to teach the musicians here. There should be more access to living legends and masters.

AC: What is it about this kind of music that inspires you?

PGM: It had the same kind of ecstatic, orgiastic, Dionysian [qualities] that I liked about noise rock and psychedelic music. Then I learned that there are so many more varied feelings, textures, and sounds, plus the history. I was a music nerd and I was checking everything out, but when I saw it live, I felt this is something I’d never experienced, even in the most amazing out rock.

I’ve been telling people about music they don’t know or get for half of my life, but sometimes they take a risk and come out, and they go, “Wow, that was really amazing.” You can’t replicate that – you can’t go buy the CD and check it out in your car. It’s not gonna pack that punch. With any good improvised music, they’re mining something that’s so rare and ephemeral, and when it happens, like they talk about duende in flamenco music, it’s palpable and real. I’m hooked on that, and also the energy of the audience – to be in the mix of that is great. That’s not exclusive to free jazz and free improvised music, but it seems to be more present.

Free improvised music, or adventurous music, as I call it, which is more all-encompassing, is kind of utopian. It’s individualism, but it’s also collective, and everyone has a part in it. It’s what punk rock should have been, maybe was. I want to live in that space and make more opportunities happen.

A poster for Epistrophy Art's upcoming show with Atomic

AC: Was there a specific show that ignited your love for out jazz?

PGM: The ROVA Saxophone Quartet at the Continental Club. The otherworldly harmonic crazy stuff going on with ROVA just opened up the possibilities of the music for me. Also Eugene Chadborne at the Cavity. Seeing Merce Cunningham at the UT Performing Arts Center with the amazing electronic musicians Kosugi and Stuart Dempster – that wasn’t improvised, that was just 20th Century music. Then Elliott Sharp at Emo’s. All that was happening around the time I was mainlining [John] Coltrane, [Albert] Ayler, and Art Ensemble [of Chicago] records, so I wanted it more and more.

When I moved here, I started working at PCL ( UT’s Perry–Castañeda Library) in the receiving room. The day I started my job, I saw Tim Kerr sorting mail. Our boss had a really great record collection, so we would all just bring music in and listen to it on a boombox in the mailroom. People would walk in and go, “What the hell is this?” Or we’d be listening to Johnny “Guitar” Watson, and they’d go [in a more enthusiastic voice] “What is this?” People would congregate around it. Walter Daniels was there, and all these other folks in bands that were happening at that time. Because UT libraries hired a lot of musicians [laughs] before they changed their requirements and they had to be student workers. That was a special time where we were just learning.

AC: When did Epistrophy Arts begin?

PGM: January 1998. We kicked it off with Joe McPhee, Arthur Doyle, Susie Ibarra, and Assif Tsahar for two nights. So I’m spoiled – that first concert we had 200 people in 33 Degrees. When it’s something new, Austin is on it. So we started right off the bat with really solid support. We’ve just pushed through for 24 years now. I took a year off when my son was born, then came back with the ICP Orchestra [Instant Composers Pool, from Holland] and the Thing, who were sort of our mainstay bands for a while.

I have to acknowledge my predecessors. Craig Koon at Sound Exchange brought Matthew Shipp and William Parker, then Dan Plunkett and Bob Coleman at 33 Degrees brought AMM, a legendary improvising ensemble. I was seeing this stuff and thought, “I wanna do this too,” and I was able to keep a regular presence. I think that helped a scene coalesce. People were talking to each other, and they’d play together sometimes. This is true with any good music – you’re gonna have these elements.

AC: Who are your holy grails?

PGM: Roscoe Mitchell, Amina Claudine Myers, David Murray, Henry Threadgill again, Wadada Leo Smith again, John Zorn. Something adventurous from Bill Frisell would be great. David Virreles, the Afro-Cuban pianist who played with Andrew Cyrille. Joëlle Léandre, the French bassist. Jakob Bro – I like him a lot. Mats Gustafson with Fire Orchestra. There’s all kinds of good stuff coming out of Europe. There’s some Colombian bands. The big dream would be the collective quintet with Myra Melford, Susie Ibarra, Mary Halvorson, Tomeka Reid, and Ingrid Laubrock. There’s also new projects I hear all the time, and I think, “Man, that’d be great.”

It’s such a golden age for this music. I don’t think too many people really appreciate it that much, especially people who invest a lot of money in stereo equipment and rare records. You’ve gotta step out and see shit that’s happening now. James Brandon Lewis, when he played here - that was a revelation to me. That made me feel the way I did when I saw Black Flag. He’s just a fountain of creativity, with so many projects – I’d love to get him back here. And Luke Stewart – there’s just so many.

I would like to incorporate a mix of living legends, unsung heroes, and young powerhouses, and build a stage for risk-taking to happen. It’s a heavy responsibility to bring a series into an already crowded field, so I don’t want to waste time on things that aren’t really gonna push and connect. We try to use that attention and that time with respect.

It’s been great. I’ve met a lot of people through this music. Just the experience of sitting in a room with people who are cool and really connecting with a musician – I just can’t get enough. I believe in this shit and I’m gonna keep doing it.